The only priority for Yup Protocol

Summary

As we have been discussing in a few previous meetings, rewards abusers are still active and we (concerned community members) feel it is not fair at all. The team must take action toward each of those accounts.

Motivation

New accounts are “stealing” curator rewards by self-voting, which results in draining the daily rewards allowance to only a few accounts.

Why is this an issue?

There are LESS THAN 50 genuine users of Yup. The rest are just abusing the rewards system. @nir, you can’t make a point that they are using the protocol better than others, because they are abusing it.
Since Yup does not have any barriers to earning YUP, there is no value for the protocol to the abusers.

@nir made a point against the barrier of entry to earn by giving an example of Aave. BUT Aave is NOT free to use, right? You need MONEY/Crypto in your wallet in the first place to use that platform, and then it is absolutely free to use.

Yup is giving away free money, printing thousands of YUP for only 10-15 accounts.

My suggestions

  • Find out the OLD USERS (users who had YUPX, those are the users who are still with us and deserve clean
    and fair protocol)

  • A soulbound NFT drop to those OLD USERS. These soulbound NFTs give users the right to earn in the Yup Protocol.

  • Next set of users will be REGULAR USERS. Take a snapshot of users BEFORE Yup got $3.5m funding. Those users will be able to mint these soulbound NFTs at very cheap prices.

  • Launch a Sybil hunting program, where community members will identify the abusers.

  • BLOCK them all.

  • The rest of the new users MUST mint one of these soulbound NFTs to EARN YUP.

  • Without NFTs, anyone can create an account, rate, collect and use the protocol but CAN NOT get rewarded for curation.

  • We can design a few categories of soulbound NFTs and give them influence points according to its tier.

Benefits

  • Inflow of money for the Yup Protocol.
  • Sell pressure will be gone.
  • Demand for YUP NFTs will rise.
  • No need to worry about abusers for long term.
  • Barrier of entry to earn model. Just like everyone else.

WE CAN NOT TAKE A TOKENISED SNAPSHOT OF THIS PROPOSAL, BECAUSE WHALES WILL OPPOSE THESE DECISIONS. THIS WILL TAKE AWAY THEIR MONEY PRINTING MACHINE.

13 Likes

I totally agree with you, the new accounts are abusing the protocol, at least a penalty system is needed for many yup sales so often, and the one who sells at least 70% of his yup.

I think it was like that before in ETH, when they sold their yup, they did not continue earning the same because their influence was decreasing, the age of the currency affected them and they could not continue earning the same. AND THAT IS VERY GOOD.

THIS USER IS LESS THAN 1 MONTH OLD, AND IS EARNING MORE THAN AN OLDER USER WHO DOES EARN YUP.
THIS NEW USER SELLS 98% OF HIS YUP. AND IS STILL GETTING BETTER REWARDS THAN ANYONE ELSE. THAT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE.

THIS IS A SUPER IMPORTANT ISSUE THAT HAS TO BE SOLVED FOR THE WELL BEING OF THE PROJECT.

HERE IS A SCREENSHOT OF THE USER

And I show the user so that they can solve this serious mistake and the user is not gaining more and more yup, because those who really have to be compensated are the hold, the holders of the token, who bet and trust in this great project.

not like the new users who do not trust and are only selling every day.

please @nir , we need support in this problem that is bothering the community.
thank you very much for your attention.

These 2 accounts are managed by the same person,

4 Likes

I like your proposal, but sell pressure will not be gone. As you have stated multiple times and I agree with you, we’re printing money out of thin air, that’s why you only see pressure to the down side.

If there is no demand for $YUP, price will never ever go up. Remember that price moves for 2 reasons, supply and demand, that’s it.

If there is no real use of $YUP token, there will not be demand at all. That’s why new use cases of $YUP token are needed ASAP

This proposal is important as well, but to me, it comes second place to what the team has to do next.

1 Like

If the team agrees to introduce a barrier to entry, the most likely scenario will be: that all the abusers will sell all the YUP they got in their wallets. Because they want to get out as soon as possible before their accounts are banned from further abuse. This may lead them to purchase Yup NFTs to become real users.

Thanks @harsh and everyone else for the feedback.

I agree with the problem, just don’t think the solutions outlined here are good enough yet. Supporting old users more than new is not a sustainable solution and will make sure we don’t grow which would be terrible. I’m also staunchly against requiring users to buy NFTs to start earning on Yup, though some friction is necessary, so want to explore further. I like the sybil hunting program and the Soulbound NFT approaches and want to add those into our thinking.

Some alternatives we’re considering:

  1. Incorporating Yup Score into users’ influence, therefore users with low yup score (bots) can’t easily participate, their likes worth little, and rewards even less. This is better than Soulbound NFTs IMO for what we’re trying to achieve, though doesn’t necessarily add buy pressure. The above address you gave as an example has a yup score of 2.6/100 in the new system, aka very low. You could even prevent anyone with a score < 5 to earn, effectively getting the same effect as the SBTs without buy pressure, which i don’t think would be big either way
  2. Lock up / burn tokens to receive an NFT that increases rewards AND gives users access to a premium version of the product: Yup Pro. This would be similar to the SBT you mentioned but serve dual purposes.
  3. Dispute resolution system using Kleros or Snapshot: user flags a potential sybil or bot, users vote on it, bot gets blocked. Flagger and voters get rewarded for helping maintain network. This should serve as a sybil hunting mechanism.

We will continue to update on this and explore new options. I’m not against any of the things you mentioned but think they should be well thought out. Yup isn’t being built for its early users, its being built for everybody. That doesn’t mean we don’t want to deter malicious activity so we will explore all directions.

Thanks again everybody, let me know what you think.

4 Likes

The thing is, if Yup was a web2 curation platform and YUP was an in-house currency with no monetary value, it was perfectly fine that you wouldn’t want to introduce the barrier to entry. But Yup is giving away free money, you must agree that it is not sustainable for the project economics.

Supporting new users by letting them abuse the reward system is not fair. What is good for new users is to answer their questions on how to use the app. And how would you feel if old users stops rating the web just because new users are eating the whole pie of daily rewards? Why a new user who is taking advantage of loopholes to earn more is more important to the project than old genuine users? New users are dumping tokens at the first chance they get, old users in contrast want to add more use cases for the token.

Yup’s influence score does not have any “visible” effect in daily use of the app. A new user with 5/100 influence is getting over thousands of YUP and that too with multiple accounts. Artificial and self voting is the real thing here.

I like the idea of Yup Pro, but that can be done by NFTs too! NFTs of different levels allow users to use different features of Yup! To mint these NFTs, the user can either pay in ETH or burn an equivalent amount of YUP. Either way, Yup is benefited.

How would you feel about the previous airdrops like Uniswap, dydx, etc being given only to the last week’s active users and not old regular users? Because according to you new users are as important as old users.

My point is just BLOCK all the addresses from receiving any rewards as soon as possible and activate Sybil hunting program. The protocol may not have any automatic detection system but we the users can spot them faster.

I am in favor of creating an ecosystem of Yup Protocol as a Web3 social platform.

How many projects that had a barrier to entry are now in the graveyard of dead web3 projects?
The model of having a barrier of entry is great for those types of games where devs can go home with profits no matter how long the lifespan of the project or how worthless the game is.

I mean AlgodTrading which predicted Tera collapse also predicted that STEPN will collapse, but for me, it seems like these predictions are not really predictions. Because all these collapses that are “predicted” is just repeating the same model that unfolded time and time again. Is not a bug it is the design.

In the case of barrier to entry games, the whole economy is based on the ability to find new users that will pay to pass that barrier in order for devs and older users to gain monetary benefits, without finding new users the game will die, because it’s mechanic is purely financial speculation I don’t know if these projects can be even be called games(unless of course, you consider financial speculation a game by its own merits.)

So if you are a game dev and you want your game to have a longer life, you don’t integrate web3 as the core mechanic of the game, instead, you could add web3 on top as something that will not change core mechanics, skins, awards, participation events, etc.

Also is a bit disheartening for any dev of DAPP, in general, to hear that 90 out of 100 issues always seem to be related to the monetary part, totally equating a DAPP with is token is a big mistake, a DAPP doesn’t live for its token is in the name “Decentralized Application”, so in the first place, it should fulfill utility, user needs, and real-world uses cases, otherwise, there’s no reason for the DAPP to exist in the first place.

“Web1”, “Web2”, and “Web3”, all these made-up terms signify just a technological struggle to provide utility.

Pricing a “like” at least for me is something that I can’t well wrap my mind around, but in any case, likes from the likes of nobody I don’t know how they could have a high monetary value if you think about it, Brave serves you an ad for a fraction of a cent, why should a “like” be valued more?

I think Kleros is much more robust it’s built for dispute resolution, and jurors need to have some qualifying traits. I guess if there’s more urgency maybe an xDai court can be used to not wait for polygon integration.

IMO Snapshot could be a bit messy, but I see its use in community government, in general, to change how a DAPP, DAO, NFT project, token, or blockchain works.
Using Snapshot to vote on essentially DAPP data could look spammy this is not to say it’s not worth a shot.

Yup Score can play an impacting role by either slashing or canceling the reward.

NFT for YUP PRO can work as a subscription model, it may be a bit tricky to balance because you need to somehow create high demand for it which is not guaranteed.

2 Likes

I completely agree with the point you made with the example of the “web3 games”. Now I can see the loophole in them very clearly. But not doing anything about the abusers and printing free money for them is also not Yup’s plan, right?

The barrier to entry I mentioned repeatedly can be anything. Not necessarily NFTs. The daily actions on Yup DO NOT penalize the user on the next day. It probably takes weeks to reduce the influence. In the meantime, abusers have earned a large chunk of YUP already.

Realistically, what is the purpose of the Yup web app? A new user only needs to go on the app once, for the sign-up process. Second, the staking page is now in the web app but it was separated for a long time. Apart from these two things, the web app serves no purpose in the process of earning. I check my analytics on the app a few times a week. But the users with multiple accounts don’t even need to interact with the web app. They just need the extension to earn YUP.

I understand that building things take time but in the meantime, KYC is a NEED for Yup’s sustainability. We are a community of a few hundred people. Out of which less than 100 are active community members. Did we gain a large chunk of users by keeping Yup KYC-free? NO. We are losing our liquidity to a few people’s greeds and abuse of the protocol.

I have few ideas regarding Yup’s influence score, but the team must BLOCK the accounts from earning anymore before that.

  • Yup Score should be one single entity comprised of off-chain (activities on the web app) + on-chain (activities on different chains). By doing this, benefits, rewards, offers, etc can be given out systematically to everyone.
  • There should be a withdrawal system on the curator, creator, and LP rewards according to the Yup Score. If a user has Yup Score over 90, they can claim 100% rewards at once. If the score is between 81-90, only 80% reward amount is claimable at once.
  • The LP rewards can be designed around the Yup score. High APR/APY to the high Yup Score users. It is very fair. Other users can earn “normal APR/APY” if they don’t have Yup account.
  • Eventually, Yup Profiles can be soulbounded as NFTs and Yup can be used as an on-chain identity.
2 Likes

I totally agree with you, we are losing liquidity, because of the greed of some people who are partly the new users because in 1 week they start to earn yup as an old user or more. Secondly, they sell 99 % of their Yup and they are not affected by their influence. that is not fair, because then they have more importance a new user, than an old one who is in the project more than 1 year, and is on hold, they sell, but they sell 1 or 3 times a month. because they are loyal users who bet on the project, which has a great potential.

but it is not rewarding the old HOLD users, because many think, why the profits little by little. and the hard part was exciting and comforting. But now it is not like that anymore, a new user can get 300 $ in 10 days, (when yes it was above 0.08 usd) and you see they were earning fast, they sold 98% of their YUP and in 10 days they were back to get 300 to 400 usd or more. It is something necessary, in order to earn you have to work hard, as it used to be in the ETH Network.

And the ones who should have more privileges are the users who are held back. We just want the same system as it was in ETH, where new users had to work harder to earn and users who sold more than 50% of their tokens, leverage affected them. For example, if they earned 1000 yup a day in standby, after selling more than 50% they can no longer earn the same 1000 yups a day.

THAT IS ONE OF THE MAIN WAYS YOU SHOULD KEEP USING THE TOKEN. I totally agree with you, we are losing liquidity, due to greed of some people who are partly the new users because in 1 week they start earning yup as old user or more. Secondly, they sell 99 % of their Yup and they are not affected by their influence, that is not fair, because then they have more importance a new user, than an old one who is in the project more than 1 year, and is on hold, they sell, but they sell 1 or 3 times a month.

because they are loyal users who bet on the project, which has great potential. but it is not rewarding the old HOLD users, because many think, from what When we started in ETH, to earn the reward took me, it took me 1 month to earn 100 $ in Yup, 1 month, another user took 3 months. and we all studied in agreement and kept curing the earnings little by little. and the hard part was exciting and comforting. But now it is not like that anymore, a new user can get 300 $ in 10 days, (when yes it was above 0.08 usd) and as you see they were earning fast, they sold 98% of their YUP and in 10 days they were back to get 300 to 400 usd or more. It is a necessary thing, in order to earn you have to work hard, as it used to be in the ETH Network. And the ones who should have more privileges are the users who are held back.

We just want the same system as it was in ETH, where the new users had to work harder
to earn and users who sold more than 50% of their tokens, leverage affected them. For example, if they earned 1000 yup a day in standby, after selling more than 50% they can no longer earn the same 1000 yups a day.

THAT IS ONE OF THE MAIN WAYS YOU SHOULD CONTINUE TO USE THE TOKEN.

Please @nir , let it be like before as you say here.

2 Likes

Good afternoon. I have been in this community for 1 year, I have never sold, and my rewards are sometimes zero

1 Like

Goodnight. No rewards since June 19. Thanks